Two years on.. still no luck!

Since I first discovered the World of Lucid Dreaming over two years ago, I have not experienced a lucid dream.

I have since developed a healthy twice-a-day 10 minute meditation habit, the finger-through-palm reality check a number of times a day and a regular dream diary. If anything these things in themselves have been enjoyable for what they are and have shaped me as a person. But I still look forward to my first lucid dream, the fruit of my endeavours.

I feel I must be missing something, or not doing something correctly. On going to bed I focus on either creating a vivid dreamscape or simply repeating 'I will lucid dream tonight'.

My friend, a lifelong lucid dreamer told me all she has ever done is think about what she wants to dream about as falling asleep, and bam! Envy is not the word :roll:

Oh that must be so very frustrating. Let's see if we can work out the issue.

Obviously if you are keeping a regular dream journal, you are remembering your dreams so this isnt an issue.

simply repeating 'I will lucid dream tonight'.

You could make a change to that which may work far better. I suggest repeating just the two words "lucid dream". I suggest to do that while observing your breath as you allow yourself to fall asleep eg think "lucid" on the inbreath and "dream on the outbreath.

This may help not just by programming yoursel to think of lucid dream while falling asleep, but also by boosting your awareness on your body (body awareness) so hopefully when you enter a LD you will notice your body has changed in some way.

Try this for 2-3 weeks while falling asleep.

Hold expectations that this could work fast, Important: dont go thinking you need to be spending time using a technique for it to work as that can stop a technique from working as well.

I have since developed a healthy twice-a-day 10 minute meditation habit,

Meditation will probably only help if you are having trouble relaxing eg getting off to sleep which some do with LD, unless you are using the meditation time for intense focus on LD (rather then in relaxation meditation) which is another thing meditation can be used for when it comes to LD.

Share more about what you are doing meditation wise?

My question to you is.. is your LD problem a relaxation one? or is something else going on here? When you try to LD, say if you were trying to WILD are you falling asleep easily enough within an hour? Do you try at times for up to an hour? (you may have to have patient in a LD attempt if you havent had a LD before thou it isnt always the case, techniques can play a big part on how successful a person is).

On going to bed I focus on either creating a vivid dreamscape

So is the issue you are doing this but then just falling into an unaware sleep? If so that is now a deeply ingrained habit, it only takes 3 weeks to start to develop a habit which then sets one up for failure.

So if something dont work within a few weeks, you need to change what you are doing and not stay doing that thing as its got less likely to work.

The time you are trying to do this, ie when you go to bed, also can be quite bad for many beginners. In your case you'd best be doing the WBTB method to start lucid dreaming. I suggest you go to this along with what I said about saying in your mind the words "lucid" and "dreaming" while watching your breath.

Also obviously you havent read many of the posts here or you would of realised the time you are doing it isnt at the easiest time. I suggest you do more reading on LD to help further engrain into your mind that you really really want one (and it will also help you to troubleshoot any problems you may get when you have your 1st experience too, so you can have a better more successful one once you do).

Anyway, I dont think its a case of you arent capable of lucid dreaming but more that it's a case that your techniques need to be improved on and changed.

At this point seeing the creating a dreamscape isnt working, leave that for a least a month while you try what I've suggested. You may be keeping your brain too active while trying to create it and hence not be allowing spontanous images to just start coming in from the subconsciousness during it to start getting you into a LD.

To signal to your subconcious things are very different "so you are going to LD".. really help it see you arent stuck in the same old.. I also suggest at this point to change your reality check. There is nothing really wrong with it but its just you really need to break your current pattern of failure and the reality check is part of your current pattern. So start also doing a new one.

Post back in a month if you still havent had a LD.

To summarise what I think you should try for 3-4 weeks.

1. You need to be trying to LD at different time (after some sleep, some time in mid sleep cycle best..others here will be able to give more precise time on when its usually best)

2. Say to yourself inside your head, "lucid" on inbreath, "dream" on outbreath do this up to an hour focused on your breathing. Allow yourself to fall asleep doing it.

3. Stop doing the creation of the dreamscape as it doesnt work for you

4. Change of reality check (to help break past failure habit of the "whole process"). Try two new reality checks.

5. Quit the meditation (unless you want to keep doing it cause you like it or if its actually helping you in some way).

Change this time instead to at least 2 sessions of 5 mins of "awareness" exercises (even more sessions is better.. it doesnt have to be as long as 5mins even regular session of 1min awareness exercise is a good thing to do). To do this just pay lots of attention to your surroundings. Look around you for anything "weird", try to observe anything and question "Could this be a dream?". If you have a clock or watch.. see if it will go weird if you are looking at it and then away and back.

6. Keep up doing the dream journal

7. Hold in mind you are starting "afresh" dont dwell at all on past LD failure as you are not doing as in the past.

You werent doing anything "wrong" (you were trying a lot of good things there), its just the techinques you are doing are not right for you.

taniaaust1 wrote: You could make a change to that which may work far better. I suggest repeating just the two words "lucid dream". I suggest to do that while observing your breath as you allow yourself to fall asleep eg think "lucid" on the inbreath and "dream on the outbreath.

I will definitely try this!

taniaaust1 wrote: Share more about what you are doing meditation wise?

Originally it was something new and interesting to try, but now I enjoy it purely as a relaxation exercise (counting breaths). I don't really associate it with LD any more, so I think I will keep it up. I don't tend to have issues falling asleep or relaxing, I can usually sleep within a few minutes with a clear mind and this also seems to help in day to day life also.

I also wake up naturally after 3-4 hours sleep, at which time I go for a little wander and then go back to bed, so this would be a good time to try the WBTB (though I always fall back asleep straight away here!).

On going to bed I focus on either creating a vivid dreamscape

The times I have tried this I usually can't sleep, my mind just stays active. So you are right in that this probably isn't for me yet.

taniaaust1 wrote: I also suggest at this point to change your reality check.

I will have a look for some alternatives to try.

taniaaust1 wrote: Change this time instead to at least 2 sessions of 5 mins of "awareness" exercises (even more sessions is better [...] To do this just pay lots of attention to your surroundings. Look around you for anything "weird", try to observe anything and question "Could this be a dream?". If you have a clock or watch.. see if it will go weird if you are looking at it and then away and back.

I will do this also!

I really appreciate your answer, this has given me new motivation. I will report back in a month or so!

It seems to me that when many people start learning about lucid dreaming, they may tend to get a little impatient with "just ordinary" non-lucid dreams. This might be somewhat insulting to the deep awareness in the mind which creates dreams.

In your post, you didn't say specifically whether or not you keep a dream journal. As I am waking up, if I remember any dream imagery or emotions, I try to quickly jot down some notes. If the dream or dream fragment seem interesting, then later I'll write a more complete description in my dream journal. If I do this fairly regularly, my dreams tend to become longer and more detailed, and my dream memory improves.

If I recall some unusual dream symbol, object, or character which feels significant, I may try to honor this dream creation in some form of art or by making a craft object, or with a spontaneous little dance or song. The unconscious mind seems to appreciate this attention and cooperation and may offer up more creative dreams, some of which may be at least partially lucid.

Before going to sleep, I often say to my inner dreamer, "Please show me a dream about what I need to know at this time in my life."

jasmine2 wrote: In your post, you didn't say specifically whether or not you keep a dream journal. As I am waking up, if I remember any dream imagery or emotions, I try to quickly jot down some notes. If the dream or dream fragment seem interesting, then later I'll write a more complete description in my dream journal. If I do this fairly regularly, my dreams tend to become longer and more detailed, and my dream memory improves.

Yes I do keep a dream journal, I usually can remember bits from 2-3 dreams if I'm lucky and I'll jot these down. Some of them seem pretty generic compared to others, but like you said the more I do this the easier it becomes.

taniaaust1 wrote: Change this time instead to at least 2 sessions of 5 mins of "awareness" exercises (even more sessions is better.. it doesnt have to be as long as 5mins even regular session of 1min awareness exercise is a good thing to do). To do this just pay lots of attention to your surroundings. Look around you for anything "weird", try to observe anything and question "Could this be a dream?". If you have a clock or watch.. see if it will go weird if you are looking at it and then away and back.

Also, you mention questioning my surroundings. Can this be done just in my head, or should I ask myself out loud? i.e will my dream-state mind also question the surroundings in this way or is it more reliable as a spoken cue?

Thanks!

Dang, that sucks man. I just discovered lucid dreaming a month ago and I've had 2 LDs so far. In the first two weeks i remember i was doing the palm with the two fingers to Reality check and i never even did it once in my dreams.. I found that just looking at my hands and studying them was WAY more effective for whatever reason and transferred into my dreams MUCH more often, causing me to notice they were odd looking and made me become lucid. I think the problem with trying to push your fingers through your hand is that you have to actually visualize and believe they will go through, and on top of that you have to be thinking that if they do, it is a dream... which is a hard thing to do 10+ times a day especially if you have work or something like that. Much easier to just look at your hands.

fearcandy_64 wrote: Also, you mention questioning my surroundings. Can this be done just in my head, or should I ask myself out loud? i.e will my dream-state mind also question the surroundings in this way or is it more reliable as a spoken cue?

Thanks!

You can question the situation any way you wish, it wont matter you are questioning a situation outloud or in your head. Seeing thou you will be doing this in real life too, I do suggest to do it inside your head as others over hearing you may otherwise think you've gone nuts :lol:

Parap wrote: I found that just looking at my hands and studying them was WAY more effective for whatever reason and transferred into my dreams MUCH more often, causing me to notice they were odd looking and made me become lucid. I think the problem with trying to push your fingers through your hand is that you have to actually visualize and believe they will go through, and on top of that you have to be thinking that if they do, it is a dream... which is a hard thing to do 10+ times a day especially if you have work or something like that. Much easier to just look at your hands.

I know exactly what you mean by that, thanks!

taniaaust1 wrote: Seeing thou you will be doing this in real life too, I do suggest to do it inside your head as others over hearing you may otherwise think you've gone nuts :lol:

Good point :D

Hello, me again!

I'm afraid there has been little development thus far.

• I have taken up checking my hands for detail / counting fingers / looking for unusual features as a new reality check which has become pretty habitual.

• I fall asleep with my mind on 'lucid' and 'dream' on my breathing pattern.

• I have also laid of the meditation, although I'm considering beginning again due to stress of late.

• My dream diary has remained consistent with at least one scene recalled every morning. If I have woken up in the night I have taken up writing down any dreams I have just had - I think this would be a good habit for WBTB as it takes thought and 10 or so minutes.

What's next I could try? Shall I keep up with these habits for now?

Thank you!

Try adding in going to sleep on your back, doing the lucid dream thought thing on the breath. The fact you then are on your back may help signal to your subconsciousness that you do not want to fall into an ordinary sleep. Try that for a week with what you already do and report back if that helps or not

:) good idea to go back to the meditation if it helps your stress.

Ive been at this for 3 years and I still only get lucid dreams every now and then. However I'm able to encourage my dreams to be more about something of my interest. And that is satisfying enough for me, in fact it's helped me relax more about lucid dreaming. Sure it doesn't happen every night, every dream, but I can trust it will happen.

Here's what I've done:

Try adding your personal interests to your technique. Like for breathing: Instead of breathing a lucid dream mantra, make a mantra about something you enjoy. Particularly something you want to dream about. or what i do: Alternate between a lucid mantra and personal mantra.

This is my slogan for lucid dreaming and even other life situations: Focus Less, Relax More

It's like being at work/school and you want to go home. Staring at the clock will make time feel like it's taking forever. Not looking at the clock however might make time feel like time is going by fast. Unless you force yourself to not look, then time will still go slow.

Same with lucid dream techniques. Don't painfully force yourself to do the technique, and don't force yourself not to do the techniques. Just keep calm, do the technique, if you're mind gets sidetracked, don't fret. Let it go and find it's way back on it's own.

That's my experience anyway.

I have tried in like one year. I took a break from it for half a year ca. Then all of the sudden! Bang! I had one. I guess i tried to hard to have a LD, so i could not make it. So my tip is, try to not focus too hard :)

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Lots of helpful stuff here, it seems that just having a relaxed attitude is the key - got to work hard on not working too hard!

Tried the lying on back thing last night and had a lot of vivid dreams - if this is related I'm not sure but I will keep on with that.

fearcandy_64 wrote: Tried the lying on back thing last night and had a lot of vivid dreams .

That may be a good sign.

Do the WBTB for a week if u can. It is very effective. And check out oger stuff in the website like dream science, LD inspiration, 101 ideas for.LD etc. These stuff gets the idea ticking over your mind and gives better understanding of the process.

While.going back to bed in WBTB, think about a previous vivid dream or somerhing u want to do in ur dream. Usually u will end up dreaming about the previous dream or ur goal. Or u migjt get lucky with a WILD! I have used the MILD/WBTB combo with success. And continue ur meditation routine. It has a plethora of other benefits, besides than increasing ur level of awareness. Infact, it might increase ur chances of having a lucid dream when combined with MILD/WBTB combo. Hope this helps!!!

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What beverages do you drink? Pretty much all store bought drinks, aside from milk and some kinds of bottled water, contain fluoride; as does tap water. Fluoride has a large number of negative effects including damage to the pineal gland which is responisble for regulating sleep patterns and dreams. Fluoride is also found in toothpaste and even if not swallowed can still be absorbed through the mouth. If any fluoride is in your daily life I'de suggest cutting it out completely. You can find toothpastes that don't contain fluoride, or bursh your teeth with alchohol or even just water. Drink only milk and reverse osmosis filtered water or spring/rain water. In addition I would suggest meditating longer if you have time. Maybe even just stick to what you've been doing but one or two days a week try 30 min to an hour. Excersize and overall body health also leads to better brain function and clarity of dreams. There are also various suppluments that help improve the clarity of dreams and thus increase your chance of lucidity. ZMA is a a great one that many people report having very vivid dreams with and is also very good for muscle recovery. Another thing I've found useful is reading your dream journal before going to bed, it helps keep the idea that you're going to be dreaming soon in your head and gives your subconcious things to look out for to trigger your concious mind. Lastly if you're extremely desperate and willing to sacrafice some sleep the wake back to bed method seems to work the best for me. The majority of my LDs came from me accidently waking up in the middle of the night and I took the opportunity to meditate for a little bit before going back to sleep, occasionally repeating in my head "you're about to be dreaming", when I went back to sleep sure enough I became lucid. So you could try setting an alarm for sometime 90 min - 2 hours after you go to sleep, meditate and think about dreaming for 5 min or so then pass back out.

Hope this helps!

I've never heard about the fluoride thing, will try to omit it myself.

So last night I had my first wet dream. I've taken up the NoFap challenge in the past year so I'm pretty sure its due to this, but I was wondering if they hold a special significance in LD? Eg. clarity of mind, a bit closer to awakening in a dream etc.

Ps. The dreams weren't especially erotic, just quite vivid. Something to do with deleting my browsing history or something! Woke up pretty damn confused.

fearcandy_64 wrote: So last night I had my first wet dream (I'm 21). I've taken up the NoFap challenge in the past year so I'm pretty sure its due to this, but I was wondering if they hold a special significance in LD? Eg. clarity of mind, a bit closer to awakening in a dream etc.

Ps. The dreams weren't especially erotic, just quite vivid. Something to do with deleting my browsing history or something! Woke up pretty damn confused.

No I don't think a wet dream of the non lucid kind would hold special significance to having an LD (that is unless you yourself believe it may.. belief itself is very important when it comes to dreams and LD). ............

I'd never heard of NoFap, so had to go and look that up.

"NoFap hosts challenges in which participants abstain from porn or masturbation. We help people improve their relationships and live more fulfilling lives. "

ummm those things actually wouldn't affect a persons relationship with their other unless their other had a thing against those things or the person excessively used porn or masturbation. In fact some use these things to get in the mood for maybe later on partner sex so they can improve some relationships.