Do your DCs know you?
Someone asked me this question "Do your DCs know you?" and I thought it was a very interesting one.
I had two LDs very recently in which DCs called me by a completely different name to my own (Im getting called Josphine when my real life name is Tania).. I had no awareness thou with my normal waking mind who they were or anything about them.
This has made me wonder if there was dreaming going on with these DCs, even before I entered the LD (which had been entered from a fully awaken state and straight into LD with full waking consciousness). So if this dream was going on before I even entered it.. it could only mean it would then be having to be going on previously when I was fully awake. (I actually do currently think we are all dreaming 24hrs a day even when awake as our subconciousness never stops).
I usually ignore completely my DCs as Im so sick of being ignored by them when I go to speak to them. I dont like to waste much time on them when I have far better things to do in my LDs but now its got my interest as Im wondering if the DCs believe they know me? (and maybe that is part of why they are choosing to ignore me??). I dont believe they are real but its would be interesting to know more about what those parts of myself think about me.
Anyway.. do your DCs know you?
I only wish I had an answer for this question....I am only able to carry out a conversation with dream characters in non-lucid dreams,which drives me absolutely insane because of course,these non-lucid dreams aren't controlled or pondered...they just happen.I have only had 2 lucid dreams as of yet and each time I became too excited and woke up in about 10 seconds :cry: But I am constantly working at it....hopeful...lol. I hope someone out there can answer your question...I have seen some posts on here where people have said that they have asked their DC's if they know them and the DC's respond with a clear "yes" but that's as far as I have seen that conversation able to go....I would love to have a lucid dream where I am able to converse with a DC and see what they have to say but right now it seems to be a waiting game for me....so I wait! Good luck and I am as eager as you are to hear any responses that you get,I'll be checking back to this thread to see what comes up.....
I think that the dreamworld is always there...however that hypothesis brings up some interesting questions. Who takes your place when you're not actively in the dream? A mindless zombie version of yourself? Perhaps the DCs are clones of real people who are awake at the time you're dreaming, and you're merely interacting with their standby personalities? So maybe we have a physical body in the real world and a dream body in the dreamworld (This is my personal view)
Or maybe you physically leave the dreamworld altogether...I'm sure this thread will provoke interesting discussion on this.
torakrubik wrote: I think that the dreamworld is always there...however that hypothesis brings up some interesting questions. Who takes your place when you're not actively in the dream? A mindless zombie version of yourself? Perhaps the DCs are clones of real people who are awake at the time you're dreaming, and you're merely interacting with their standby personalities? So maybe we have a physical body in the real world and a dream body in the dreamworld (This is my personal view)
Or maybe you physically leave the dreamworld altogether...I'm sure this thread will provoke interesting discussion on this.
Your point is very interesting and I also view the dreamworld in a similar way.I had a conversation the other day where I was trying to explain dreams in the same way as you did above.I was saying something like this.... Imagine if our dreamworld is actually the spirit world and all these dream characters are all spirits...perhaps when we dream,we enter the spiritual world.Considering that people are able to see friends,family and pets that have passed away,and even people that we never knew that are no longer here,perhaps these are all the unfamiliar faces that we see in our dreams...the reason that people say that although it is someone they never knew in real life,they felt an amazing connection to them in their dreams that they can't explain...possibly because we are all connected spiritually and when we dream,we dream through our spirit body,so we relate to these strangers in our dreams in a purely spiritual sense,different from reality where we relate more physically.
Also,if people have out of body experiences where they see and feel their spirit leave their body,and it's their spirit body that enters the dreamworld,then dreaming is completely spiritual...so would this not mean that we all have a physical body that responds on a physical level and a spirit body that responds on a spiritual level and it seems that the only way we can experience the spiritual side is during dreams...and if our dreams are controlled by our subconscious,is it possible that our subconscious is our actual spirit? Our physical body is our temple where our spirit resides..but it is our physical body and everything that goes along with this reality that causes us to break our spirit and move farther from the spiritual world. So,my pondering this view made me wonder,concerning dream characters,if the reason why they respond the way that they do is because they are spirits and free from the chains of the physical body...so when we tell them that they are dreaming,they sometimes say that this is not a dream,it's real...because they are alive in the spiritual world,while our spirits are still chained to our physical bodies...and do we not have a cord that keeps us connected to our bodies? When we were born we were cut from an umbilical cord.It was removed from the outer physical body but it was not cut from the spiritual body.But it was 'disconnected'...and so we are disconnected from spirit in a sense and it is able to separate but only when we are asleep..not conscious.If our spirit is in control of our dreams,where would it take us? To the spiritual world it seems.We bring our dreams into reality when we speak of them and remember them,bringing our 'spirit' life into our physical life...well,is it the same when we dream,our spirit bringing our physical 'waking consciousness' into the spirit world? Believe me,I'm sorry if this sounds confusing,but it's a bit hard to explain thoughts sometimes when they go on and on(as I know this post has).... :oops
Not sure,there could be some sense to it or I have just thought myself into a conundrum...lol
torakrubik wrote: I think that the dreamworld is always there...however that hypothesis brings up some interesting questions. Who takes your place when you're not actively in the dream? A mindless zombie version of yourself?
I guess my mindless zombie is called Josphine then :) . Maybe I should try to find a mirror in the dream world and ask for Josphine to appear and talk to me.
Perhaps the DCs are clones of real people who are awake at the time you're dreaming, and you're merely interacting with their standby personalities?
Interesting thoughts :)
Come to think of it, they rarely do. I'm not just talking about any old dream character, but those ones that have a knowledge that it is a lucid dream and have a personality.
They may know my name at times, but still I feel like they are a stranger to me and I a stranger to them, and yet, we feel like we are kindred spirits and on an emotional level we are best friends. Even if it seems like they don't know me or what I am thinking in the dream.
I have tested that before, wondering if they know what I am thinking, and they deny it, but I still think if I grill them more they will finally admit that we are sharing the same mind and there is no reason why they shouldn't know me inside and out and perhaps more than I even know myself.
The more I keep thinking that way, the more it will end up happening in the dream. Our own views, theories and beliefs will actually change our dreams in the long run and they will cater to what we already thought in the first place. So I am not sure if DC's are real from a different plane of existence, but that is NOT my belief and my dreams always prove my hypothesis because it was what I truly believed. If someone thought differently their dreams would reflect that too and we all start reconfirming through our dreams what we already believed whether it was true or not.
HAGART wrote:
The more I keep thinking that way, the more it will end up happening in the dream. Our own views, theories and beliefs will actually change our dreams in the long run and they will cater to what we already thought in the first place. So I am not sure if DC's are real from a different plane of existence, but that is NOT my belief and my dreams always prove my hypothesis because it was what I truly believed. If someone thought differently their dreams would reflect that too and we all start reconfirming through our dreams what we already believed whether it was true or not.
That's a very interesting point; it will certainly throw into question any evidence in an attempt to prove whether DCs are independent of ourselves. I guess one way to validate evidence is to have a similar experience reviewed by multiple people...of course at present this is not possible.
That's the catch of using a dream to prove a point. It may just prove it because that's what you wanted to believe. Dreams are unreliable and illogical and so are the DC's that inhabit them. But they are not random, and there must be a commonality that we all share when interacting with them.
HAGART wrote: That's the catch of using a dream to prove a point. It may just prove it because that's what you wanted to believe. Dreams are unreliable and illogical and so are the DC's that inhabit them. But they are not random, and there must be a commonality that we all share when interacting with them.
i dont think dreams r unreliable and illogical. if thats the point, there is no meaning in we r exploring our dreams. if u r saying about DC, they r just there to make the scene better and believable. am studying to be an interior designer and architecture. some time i asks my dream to give me something to look on like designs i never seen b4, and it always grand me something to rely on. who makes that?? who hears our requests and commands. i believe in a inner observer who records everything we see, hear ,experience, and he got all the answer we want, he got his own point, not we just want to hear. he is a part of our self that we dont know yet. and thats y am here at first place. this is just my opinion. :|
R99 wrote: i dont think dreams r unreliable and illogical
Let's agree to disagree. But I say they are unreliable because they are never the same, and dreams are anything, but logical. They are created by subconscious FEELINGS in my opinion. Doesn't mean they are unimportant because I think we humans, as smart and logical as we may think we are, are still 99% emotional thought. And dreams are a great place to show us what we feel. They are a great way to get in touch with yourself, but seldom (if at all) proves a theory you may have.
R99 wrote: i believe in a inner observer who records everything we see, hear ,experience, and he got all the answer we want, he got his own point
I think there is an aspect of our minds too that has no emotional bias and just observes all we do as if it is watching a movie and not a part of this reality. I think most animals on this planet view reality that way and deep down our lizard brain still exists that way. And from what I know about meditation, it removes logic and emotion and leaves you thinking with that aspect of mind. Maybe DC's can tap into that and we need to interact with them knowing that our own logic and emotions may cloud what they are trying to say and show us. Don't blame the DC, blame the observer...... :ugeek:
okay HAGART let say u r right, dreams are never the same, it changes every time we see. (but some dreams r repeats itself not by events in dreams but the story mode or DC r same. u didnt mention that.) if u r expert enough, u can question every DC or object in dream. its there bcoz of a purpose. it want to notify us something. we just dont know. the dreams r never works as physical world. its always symbolize. these r not just my thought. i got this from Robert Waggoner's book. our emotions and thoughts never works as physical world. lets say am now in my house physically but i can reach anywer with my mind lets say outer space. a rocket reach there by hours. but our mind can get der in fraction of seconds. that we calls day dreaming. do not question the mind it is complex and cannot be defined by just science factors. no one can create a computer as complicated as human mind ( scientists r working on that, but human heart cannot be put in to a chip or a processor like the dialogue in terminator salvation.) wen u say dreams r illogical and unreliable, at some point u can prove it, but its not the entire truth.the truth is nobody is smart enough to understand dream fully coz it works in a different way its only symbolize. like i had a dream, a girl predicting two numbers 2014 and 2024 the number could be anything we dont know. tani gave me some insight on it but u cant be sure. in our knowledge its year, who knows. i can only wait, maybe its just random (but it was LD). u r a dreamer u know the complication of a dream. people just act silly about dream wen we try to talk about it bcoz they dont know nothing about it. dont be those people we r unique. ( to them its JUST A DREAM, i think we need some more great word for this magical phenomenon) just like that we r not even able to scratch its surface. am having dreams since i born, y its happening. but ofcoz u got ur scientific point, that i cannot compete with coz my knowledge is limited. i guzz u got my point that i am trying to prove. :)
I hear and listen to you and you did as well with me... but we won't be persuaded so easily. Let's just agree to disagree and leave it at that for now. Let's leave this alone because there is no right or wrong. And I think you agree with that.
common HAGART say something intelligent. share ur thoughts wat ever it is. and dont say inner observer (we dont know about it more) dont have emotional value, it got everything we feels. thats y its trying get our attention through dreams.
HAGART wrote: The more I keep thinking that way, the more it will end up happening in the dream. Our own views, theories and beliefs will actually change our dreams in the long run and they will cater to what we already thought in the first place. So I am not sure if DC's are real from a different plane of existence, but that is NOT my belief and my dreams always prove my hypothesis because it was what I truly believed. If someone thought differently their dreams would reflect that too and we all start reconfirming through our dreams what we already believed whether it was true or not.
Great point that we all would be reconfirming different things based on our own thoughts of it.
torakrubik wrote: I think that the dreamworld is always there...however that hypothesis brings up some interesting questions. Who takes your place when you're not actively in the dream? A mindless zombie version of yourself? Perhaps the DCs are clones of real people who are awake at the time you're dreaming, and you're merely interacting with their standby personalities? So maybe we have a physical body in the real world and a dream body in the dreamworld (This is my personal view)
Or maybe you physically leave the dreamworld altogether...I'm sure this thread will provoke interesting discussion on this.
It's really an interesting thought.
For those who think it doesn't make any sense, think like this: We are active all the day long, physically, but what happens at night, we just lay motionless in our beds(for almost 8 hours), my point is, why can't the opposite be possible, we are actively present in the dreamworld for 8 hours and then when we wake up to our physical reality ,(let's just say)our dreambody lies in the dreamworld like a zombie, or maybe a absent-minded version of ourself and maybe playing the role of DC in other people dreams.
who knows??? :!:
R99 wrote: common HAGART say something intelligent. share ur thoughts wat ever it is.
I'll be honest. At first I thought you were insulting me and being sarcastic, but now I think I just misinterpreted and you do value what I have to say and were disappointed that I wanted to stop. I don't like to argue, and especially about things that are open to interpretation and there is no right or wrong answer, only what we feel is true.
So here is my belief about dreams and reality:
When awake we are bombarded with external information in the form of light waves (sight), compression waves (sound), and all other sorts of information that we can sense. But it has no meaning until our brains process it and give it meaning. Then it feels real.
When asleep we are NOT bombarded with external information at all. But the brain never stops. It still continues processing information, but instead of using our senses, it can only use what it can get. When asleep our minds drift and daydream, and because there is nothing else for the mind to process it takes that information and gives it meaning. Then it feels real.
So dreams feel as real as awake sometimes. But in a dream, the source that created the reality was our own internal thoughts that continue to drift when we are asleep. So although dreams are a great way to know ourselves, I don't think we interact with any other spiritual plane, leave a body behind in a dream or can predict the future or travel to other lands or outer space or remote view. It just FEELS like we are. It truly does FEEL real at times.
Our minds are great at making things feel real. When awake this feels real doesn't it? But all we are sensing are vibrations and waves and our minds just interpret it and process it and it makes it feel real. In reality the waking universe is just information without meaning and even a solid object is mostly empty space in between the atoms, perhaps as empty as looking into outer space.
But without our minds to create meaning and hold places and objects in it, even if we can't see them, we would either go insane or be as intelligent as an ant. (And I don't think ants have it all bad. I sometimes envy them because they never have to consider these thoughts that we humans have.)
Anyway, you said, 'share your thoughts whatever it is', so I did.
R99 wrote: to them its JUST A DREAM, i think we need some more great word for this magical phenomenon
Throughout the ages, whenever there was something that couldn't be explained it was always labeled as 'magic'. Even if I can't explain or understand dreams fully, and I don't claim to, I am reluctant to blame it on magic or other mystical forces. And if there IS an astral plane or true Out of Body, then that would be reality and not magical anymore. I wish there was because it would make life more interesting, but I'm a skeptic. I think our minds are just very imaginative. However, after saying that, a very vivid lucid dream that feels like you are out of your body or on a different plane or in a different dimension still FEELS amazing and I will never discredit the feeling, just question the reason.
HAGART wrote: I'll be honest. At first I thought you were insulting me and being sarcastic, but now I think I just misinterpreted and you do value what I have to say and were disappointed that I wanted to stop. I don't like to argue, and especially about things that are open to interpretation and there is no right or wrong answer, only what we feel is true.
So here is my belief about dreams and reality:
When awake we are bombarded with external information in the form of light waves (sight), compression waves (sound), and all other sorts of information that we can sense. But it has no meaning until our brains process it and give it meaning. Then it feels real.
When asleep we are NOT bombarded with external information at all. But the brain never stops. It still continues processing information, but instead of using our senses, it can only use what it can get. When asleep our minds drift and daydream, and because there is nothing else for the mind to process it takes that information and gives it meaning. Then it feels real.
So dreams feel as real as awake sometimes. But in a dream, the source that created the reality was our own internal thoughts that continue to drift when we are asleep. So although dreams are a great way to know ourselves, I don't think we interact with any other spiritual plane, leave a body behind in a dream or can predict the future or travel to other lands or outer space or remote view. It just FEELS like we are. It truly does FEEL real at times.
Our minds are great at making things feel real. When awake this feels real doesn't it? But all we are sensing are vibrations and waves and our minds just interpret it and process it and it makes it feel real. In reality the waking universe is just information without meaning and even a solid object is mostly empty space in between the atoms, perhaps as empty as looking into outer space.
But without our minds to create meaning and hold places and objects in it, even if we can't see them, we would either go insane or be as intelligent as an ant. (And I don't think ants have it all bad. I sometimes envy them because they never have to consider these thoughts that we humans have.)
Anyway, you said, 'share your thoughts whatever it is', so I did.
All that you said above is the scientific definition of a dream. BUT what makes it look or feel magical is its reality. We, lucid dreamers, have experienced dreams as vivid and real as waking life( i have not yet). Can the mind just create all those ILLUSIONISTIC feelings? Some of us have even had 360° view, how can the mind create that when it has not experienced it in real life and doesn't know how it feels like or how to interpret it. I don' know which side I am on cause I don't know whole story or information of either sides and I want to know more about this.
First of all, HAGART, i never insult anybody, everybody have their own experience, that way everybody is unique. am sorry u felt that way, it maybe bcoz of my stupid English knowledge, ( i got this language from English movies and News, and not from School, in my state der is no proper education for English language. even if u r a graduate in here, its hard to speak in English. so every word i read in this site, am learning.)
I think dream characters play many roles: but I think they are all projections from yourself, or aspects of yourself ( after all, the dream is your creation; IN you). They can represent parts of yourself ( eg: a child could represent a vulnerable part of yourself; a mother, or wise woman may represent a part of yourself that nurtures your self etc., or symbolising your need for nurturing.) They can be strangers who you don't recognize, but are symbols for some of your own thoughts ( projections), they can represent your thoughts and feelings in DC form of people you know ( and at the same time you can know who they are, but their form in your dream looks nothing like them); they can be visual representations of your fears, hopes, or desires. I think the same is for animal DCs; they are symbolic projections from your inner self. They can be meaningful; or just representations of some of the jumble left over from your day.
When i try to talk to my DC, they ran away, i dont know why. :lol:
Je-Je wrote: When i try to talk to my DC, they ran away, i dont know why. :lol:
This has happened to me too and many other people here. I also don't know why, but I think the reason might be they(our subconscious) just don't have anything to say, but thinking the other way, how could that be possible.... :?
My DCs will talk to me, and answer my questions etc. I often 'know' who they are but they have a different form ( even my husband will look different in my dreams, but I still know it's him).For example, people at work, or relatives, will often appear in my dreams looking very different, and even having different names, but I know who they are. My pets will appear also, looking different, or sometimes as a different animal form, but I recognize and know them. There are always unknown 'strangers' too though.
Interesting thread! Like many others I believe that DCs are parts of our selfs. I know some parts of myself, but there are still some that remain unknown. So in my dreams I know some of my DCs, but others are strangers. :)
mia wrote: I often 'know' who they are but they have a different form
I've noticed in many of my lucid dreams, I sense the presence of somebody before I turn to look at them. I knew they were there and who it was before I see them. And if they look a little different than waking life it doesn't matter because I just 'know' it is them. (Even I look different in lucid dream mirrors too.)
I've even sensed a presence, heard a voice speaking to me, turned to see what it was and saw a plant!. But it spoke to me anyway as though it was sentient. The visuals of the DC don't matter as much as just feeling like there was an entity or presence there to begin with.
I also had a LD once in which I was with some people, but they were dumb, zombie, brainless type dream characters and I felt a presence as if there was an entity in the room and it was a small head-like-toy. It didn't speak, but it truly felt like there was a being living inside it. IT was like that inanimate object was more of a DC than the ones that looked like people. And it was just a feeling that it was alive, but an undeniable one.
Weird stuff..........
HAGART wrote:
mia wrote:I often 'know' who they are but they have a different form
I've noticed in many of my lucid dreams, I sense the presence of somebody before I turn to look at them. I knew they were there and who it was before I see them. And if they look a little different than waking life it doesn't matter because I just 'know' it is them. (Even I look different in lucid dream mirrors too.)
I've even sensed a presence, heard a voice speaking to me, turned to see what it was and saw a plant!. But it spoke to me anyway as though it was sentient. The visuals of the DC don't matter as much as just feeling like there was an entity or presence there to begin with.
I also had a LD once in which I was with some people, but they were dumb, zombie, brainless type dream characters and I felt a presence as if there was an entity in the room and it was a small head-like-toy. It didn't speak, but it truly felt like there was a being living inside it. IT was like that inanimate object was more of a DC than the ones that looked like people. And it was just a feeling that it was alive, but an undeniable one.
Weird stuff..........
I always experience a feeling of a sentient being whenever I interact with a DC. This does suggest that there is a difference between this feeling and that of hollow 'shell' DCs. Perhaps the first kind have a deeper meaning or existence
I have always thought that dreams are a medium in which your subconscious thoughts/feeling were manifested until I reflected on my most recent LD. The first thing I did was have a sit-down with a representation of my subconscious. Unfortunately I don't recall the conversation but I sort of remember the representation. He looked like the mentor for the receiver of memories in the Giver if you've ever seen that movie. But that's besides the point. My experience got me thinking: If your subconscious can take on a form that you can interact with like a DC, then why use a dream to show your inner thoughts/feelings? Not completely sure where I'm going with this but I just thought it good to share my thoughts on the matter.
dreams are great at showing oneself ones own thoughts and feelings. ............
Im glad you posted on this thread and I'd forgotten about these LDs and the Josephine thing.
as far as my DC's go, they are fully aware of me when im around and they call me by my nickname - Tear , well at least the important ones. i have few DC's that are important part of the dream, each with their own names, personality, and more. on few ocasions when i had nightmares they would sometimes show up, helping me take care of the problem. one of them was my Mentor when i was learning to fly in a dream. and one of them got even angry at me for "weasting my life" and hit me. i woke up soon after and actualy felt the pain of being hit. or at least thats what i think i felt.
yeah, they know me alright ^^